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Enough Low Rpm Pulling Power 3:73 Gears..????

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by 1928 Chevy CJ5, Mar 23, 2021.

  1. Mar 23, 2021
    ITLKSEZ

    ITLKSEZ Hope for the best, prepare for the worst

    Spokane Valley, WA
    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2015
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    6,686
    Lift your wheels and make sure your brakes aren’t dragging. It sounds like you might be losing significant wheel speed between shifts.
     
  2. Mar 23, 2021
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
    Messages:
    5,652
    That's a really big rpm drop from 1st to 2nd....my T14 only drops about 1000rpm when shifting from 1st to 2nd. The V6 pulls nicely, but 1000rpm is a bit low IMO. I usually shift a bit above 2500 rpm (3000 if in the mts on an incline) and it drops to about 1500 which keeps it a bit more in the power band. I do have a slight performance cam, and it definitely reduced some of the low end pull...
     
  3. Mar 24, 2021
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2002
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    12,378
    10 or 15 mph isn't very fast for first gear with 3.73 gears. :confused:
     
    FinoCJ likes this.
  4. Mar 24, 2021
    FinoCJ

    FinoCJ 1970 CJ5 Staff Member

    Bozeman, MT
    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2013
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    5,652
    As ITLKSEZ pointed out, doing some rpm and gearing calculations, you need to be around 22mph in 1st gear to get to 3000 rpm....if you are shifting between 10-15mph, you may be short shifting a bit too much....that also being said, even with 33s, if the jeep is rolling, its usually good to run in 2nd gear even if it lugs a bit....spark advance issue?
     
  5. Mar 24, 2021
    boopiejones

    boopiejones I can’t drive 55

    California east bay
    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2020
    Messages:
    547
    The T14 transmission has a 3.10 first gear and 1.61 second gear. That’s a 92% difference. Compare that to the T90, which only has an 80% difference between gears. So you’re getting a significantly larger drop in RPMs when shifting the T14. Combine that with being on a hill (losing speed and RPM) and possibly short shifting (low RPM to begin with)

    you say you’re shifting at 10-15 mph. With the gearing and tire info you provided, you’re only at 2,000 rpm in first gear at 15 mph. And only 1,400 rpm at 10mph. So you’ll be dropping below 1,000 rpm when you shift into second, and that’s before accounting for speed lost on the hill. I personally think you need to shift a lot later, as that may very well be the only problem.

    Gearing Calculator | RPM and Tire Diameter to km/h - mph with Shift Tracer
     
  6. Mar 24, 2021
    RATTYFLATTY

    RATTYFLATTY I think you need a little more throttle

    Central MN
    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2007
    Messages:
    520
    from RATTYFLATTY..... If I have a Flat lobe on the cam... wouldn't It have the same NO Power symptom. in 1st gear...?? and how could using high zinc oil un-flatten a cam lobe...??

    A flat lobe is less noticeable in 1st vs 3rd. No, high zinc oil will not fix the cam but it will make the new one I installed not wear out.
     
  7. Mar 24, 2021
    Norcal69

    Norcal69 Out of the box thinker 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Northern California
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    Sep 6, 2014
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    3,569
    This sounds like an carb issue to me. You say its when you go up hill? Perhaps you are flooding over from the angle?
    I have 3.31 gears, 33" tires and regularly start out in 2nd on my T18 which is essentially a t14 from 2nd to 4th gears.
     
  8. Mar 24, 2021
    1928 Chevy CJ5

    1928 Chevy CJ5 Member

    Southern New Mexico
    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2020
    Messages:
    71
    OK... Thanks again... I really appreciate all your input........ You are probably right about me shifting too early and at too slow of speed at too low of RPM..... I was just guessing about the RPM... because I don't have a tachometer...... I know that I was Not going over 15 MPh , up a slight hill when I shift into 2nd........... probably too slow to move out of first into second...... I will get it out on the paved road and let you all know how it does at higher speeds & higher RPM... before shifting...
     
    Glenn likes this.
  9. Mar 24, 2021
    Glenn

    Glenn Kinda grumpy old man Staff Member

    Apopka, Fl
    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2002
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    12,378
    Engine noises can easily fool one into thinking rpm's are higher than they really are.
     
  10. Mar 24, 2021
    John Gedde

    John Gedde Been around the block once or twice...

    Middle Island, NY
    Joined:
    Oct 23, 2019
    Messages:
    125
    What do you mean "bogs down?" I have a '69 with the Dauntless and 3.73 gears and could offer some comparative insight... What I can for sure is you can run 1st gear well above 10-15 MPH. Despite the racket it makes, the Dauntless can rev much higher than you'd expect. Get a tach and when you're pulling shift at at least 3500 RPM.... The shift to second is a big jump in RPM. It's only a three speed and you've gotta work with what ya got!

    John
     
  11. Mar 24, 2021
    Mike C

    Mike C Member

    Austin, TX
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    Feb 19, 2007
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    743
    This is some strange math. 3.10-1.62=1.49 and 1.49 divided by 3.1=.4806 and x 100= 48.06% so there is a 48 percent drop between 1st and second. Or said another way, 2nd gear is 51.94 percent less than 1st.

    I guess you were saying that 1st gear is 92% MORE than second and that is true but not how you would measure gear difference.

    Normally I would say start with ignition, the old adage that 90% of carb issues are ignition, but since this seems to be only going uphill I would start by adjusting float level and seeing what else may be wrong with the carb.
     
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  12. Mar 24, 2021
    jeep2003

    jeep2003 Well-Known Member

    Upstate NY
    Joined:
    May 30, 2006
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    1,932
    maybe you can make a video? Iv got the same setup and it has no problem even towing a 2000lb trailer up hill just off idle. Mine has always been not quite right either. When i first got it ran beautifully. Somewhere during the restoration it went wrong and i had a heck of a time getting it to run right. Replaced carb and dizzy and other stuff in the process. After much fettling got it sorta working right again but never really perfect. The other day i read modern carbon plug wires instead of copper core can make an old engine run bad. Just a thought. Also a thing to check would be the plastic covered timing gear I guess they fall apart. If i recall I think someone said you can see it through the dizzy hole. I checked mine for slop by turning the engine back and forth and see if the rockers have a delay.
     
  13. Mar 24, 2021
    1928 Chevy CJ5

    1928 Chevy CJ5 Member

    Southern New Mexico
    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2020
    Messages:
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    Ok... thanks for the input.... I hear you all.... and I plan to take it out onto better roads next week and try driving it differently... and then if I am not happy with the results..... I will again look into the ignition and carb situation.... until then, ........ we will wait and see......
     
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