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71 Wheeling Rig

Discussion in 'Builds and Fabricators Forum' started by Fireball, Jan 18, 2021.

  1. May 7, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
    Joined:
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    Finally started working on gears tonight.

    Disassembled the ouput shaft so I could install everything on the new Novak shaft.

    3rd gear, syncho, the 3-4 hub (still assembled), the snap ring that holds the hub in place, and the thrust washer for the input shaft:
    [​IMG]

    The 1-2 shift collar removed from the hub. I wrapped it in a towel like Novak suggested to keep the balls and springs from flying everywhere. Besides the 3 main springs/balls, there is a single smaller one closer to the back of the hub. Novak does not supply a replacement for that ball/spring so be careful not to shoot it across the garage. It was in the smaller hole near the bottom of the picture:
    [​IMG]

    A couple more snap rings and everything is apart. It's in order front to back and the side facing up goes towards the back of the transmission. From left to right; snap ring, 2nd gear thrust washer, second gear, second gear synchro, snap ring, 1-2 hub, 1-2 shift collar, snap ring:
    [​IMG]

    After a cleaning everything with brake clean, it was time to put it all on the new shaft. There is a confusing bit here. The old shaft above has no ridges and needs a snap ring and thrust washer in front of 2nd gear. The new shaft has a ridge in this portion and does not use the snap ring or the thrust washer. You can see the ridge in this picture:
    [​IMG]

    There is no place for a snap ring. The thrust washer fits over the ridge, but it makes the whole assembly too long for the rear snap ring to fit. Without the thrust washer it fits together perfectly. Novak's instructions seem to be out of date. They talk about the very last of the T18s being set up like this and needing to buy the snap ring and thrust washer when installing their adapter into one of them. It seems like they've updated the shaft to match the newer transmissions, but not their documentation. Once I figured that out the rest was pretty straight forward.

    I used assembly lube or 30wt oil on all the moveing parts during assembly. Clamping the shaft vertically in the vice using a towel made assembly easier. Here is 2nd gear, it's new synchro, and the front snap ring for the 1-2 hub in place:
    [​IMG]

    Next was getting all the ball and springs back into the 1-2 hub and the shift collar over them. The smaller single ball was easy to do by hand. I used a hose clamp to hold the 3 larger ones in place. With the hub slid up against the hose clamp, I could use a screw driver to push the balls and shifting plates under the collar:
    [​IMG]

    Back together:
    [​IMG]

    A real big help:
    [​IMG]

    1-2 hub installed and held in place with a snap ring. That finishes the back part of the shaft:
    [​IMG]

    The front half was easy. 3rd gear, new 3rd gear sychro, 3-4 hub/collar, snap ring, thrust washer for the input shaft. The shift plates for the 3-4 hub are easy to stick in place with assembly lube, slide the collar on, then then install the internal snap rings:
    [​IMG]

    The output shaft is done (with the spacer temporarily slide on the back. It has to come off to install the rear bearing.):
    [​IMG]

    Next is making a dummy shaft for the countershaft gear and dealing with more rollers than I want to count.
     
  2. May 7, 2021
    Mr Vaughan

    Mr Vaughan

    i did that just last night with my T90, which i'm assuming has far less than the T18. it was actually fairly simple once i figured out exactly what i was doing.
     
  3. May 7, 2021
    Buildflycrash

    Buildflycrash More or Less in Line. 2024 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Gulf Breeze FL...
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    I didn't do the bridge on mine. Was that in the Novak instructions or something you came up with and added?
     
  4. May 7, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    It was my own idea. I didn't like how the Novak method bolts to the bellhousing where there is no cast in boss for the bolt. Their method is a lot faster and easier but I like to do things that hard way.
     
    Ol Fogie and Rubicloak like this.
  5. May 7, 2021
    Buildflycrash

    Buildflycrash More or Less in Line. 2024 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Gulf Breeze FL...
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    I wasn't jazzed about the hole I drilled and tapped either. I ended up grinding down the ridge inside the bell and putting a nut on that one bolt.
     
  6. May 7, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    That's a good idea I hadn't thought of. Makes it hard to pull the transmission leaving the bellhousing on the motor though. :D
     
    Rubicloak likes this.
  7. May 9, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
    Joined:
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    Drove over to chat with the neighbors. While the people were chatting, the Jeep got to chat with a 20 year younger sibling:
    [​IMG]

    Smelled antifreeze on the way home and crawled underneath. The lower radiator hose has a slow leak at the pump. I'll have to tighten the clamp to see if it goes away. I really don't want to drain it to investigate but I'll probably have to:
    [​IMG]

    Then it was time to deal with these:
    [​IMG]

    Shaft cleaned up and I chopped a dummy shaft out of some 3/4" black pipe. It's about .020" smaller than the actual shaft so it slides out easily:
    [​IMG]

    The sticky assembly goo worked great for putting the rollers in. After putting the first row of rollers in, I used a socket to push them down to make room for the second row:
    [​IMG]

    I also used a socket underneath to keep the spacer and dummy shaft from falling out the bottom:
    [​IMG]

    First row shoved in the other end:
    [​IMG]

    All 88 rollers and washers in place. You can see the dummy shaft in the middle of things:
    [​IMG]

    I stuck the thust washers to the case with the assembly goo and oiled the side that faces the counter gear:
    [​IMG]

    Gear in the case, thrust washer lined up by finger, and the real shaft pushing the dummy shaft out the front:
    [​IMG]

    The far end of the sahft is through the thrust washer, lined up with the hol, and ready to tap into place with the dead-blow:
    [​IMG]

    Shaft tapped in and retainer in place:
    [​IMG]

    Success! Turns silky smooth with no play whatsoever:
    [​IMG]

    I'll see If I can get the top shaft in tomorrow night.
     
  8. May 9, 2021
    Buildflycrash

    Buildflycrash More or Less in Line. 2024 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Gulf Breeze FL...
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    The next part is where I had some trouble. I had to lower the counter shaft in order to get the main shaft in. So the dummy shaft needed to be the same length as the inside of the case so it could drop down but still keep everything together. Funny thing was mine came out with the counter shaft in place but would not go back together. After that I had to hold the main shaft up in the bearing holes in order to have enough room to get the counter shaft back in alignment.

    [​IMG]
     
  9. May 9, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    That's interesting. Mine came out with no issues. I'm hoping I can put it back in without issue too. If not, I like your hanger idea.
     
    Puddle Jumper likes this.
  10. May 9, 2021
    Ol Fogie

    Ol Fogie 74 cj5 304, 1943 mb

    Southern...
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    Nov 24, 2019
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    Now that you mentioned it I think I had the same problem with a T-90 reassembly. If I recall I had to make myself a dummy shaft for the counter gear exactly the same length as the counter gear with the thrust washers in place because there was no room to get your fingers in there to align them up with the main shaft gear set installed.
    I also found if you stand the trans case up vertically on it's end with the front end down, assembly went much better as you were not fighting gravity with the heavy gear sets as much, things simply needed to be moved back and forth to align them up and not lifted up and down.
     
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  11. May 9, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    With the 1-2 shift collar slid forward and the 3-4 collar slide back I managed to finagle everything in with the lower shaft in place:
    [​IMG]

    I'll tackle the bearings later tonight. Did you guys use a press for the bearings?
     
    Ol Fogie and 3b a runnin like this.
  12. May 9, 2021
    Ol Fogie

    Ol Fogie 74 cj5 304, 1943 mb

    Southern...
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    Not as I remember on the T-90. Just a soft face mallet or maybe tap gently with a ball peen.
     
    Fireball likes this.
  13. May 9, 2021
    Buildflycrash

    Buildflycrash More or Less in Line. 2024 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Gulf Breeze FL...
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    I had to press mine.
     
  14. May 9, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    I'm thinking I'll have to. The front one acts like it will go on without too much trouble but the rear is acting like it's going to take some effort.
     
    Ol Fogie likes this.
  15. May 9, 2021
    Renegade ll

    Renegade ll Member

    Thayne Wyoming
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    Roy it's really coming together!!! I can hardly wait for you to take a spin with the rebuilt drivetrain.
     
    Fireball likes this.
  16. May 10, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    Not a lot of pictures tonight, but the main chunck of the transmission is back together.

    I had some confusion with the front bearing. The old shaft had the narrower 20mm thick front bearing, but my new shaft was made for the 23mm front bearing. Luckily the rebuilt kit came with a 23mm bearing so that was OK. My problem was not being able to get the snapring on the shaft with the oil slinger in place. Thankfully a Google search found this post from nickmil (who KNOWS what he's talking about): My lengthy Borg warner T18 rebuild thread. The thicker bearing doesn't use a slinger. Pulled the bearing back off, removed the slinger and it went together great:
    [​IMG]

    ...except the OD of the outer snap rings that come on the bearings is too large to fitt in the retainers. Discard those and use the ones that come with the rebuild kit.

    I was going to use the press for the larger bearing, but my wife had already gone to bed and I can't get this 120lb thing on the press without hurting myself. So I used to piece of 2" square tubing to see if the bearing would go move at all by hand. Sure enough it did. A few good whacks with the rawhide hammer and it was in place.

    I bolted the front and rear retainers in place and had a mild panic when the input and output shafts were locked together. There were two issues. The 4th gear syncho had attached itself to the input gear when I pounded the rear bearing on. I used a screw driver to gently release it. After that the shafts were turning independently, but only with great effort. I had a light bulb moment and put the gaskets under the retainers. With the additional end play everything works perfect.
    [​IMG]

    It turns smoothly through all the gears. Whoohoo! :bananatool:

    Next is getting the top back on and sealing it up so I can paint it.
     
    truckee4x4, Twin2, dozerjim and 9 others like this.
  17. May 10, 2021
    Michael Wedin

    Michael Wedin Member

    Sweetwater, TX
    Joined:
    Mar 20, 2020
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    64
    Could you have left the cluster gear with dumby shaft laying in the bottom until the main and input shaft was bolted up and then turned the case upside down and left gravity work with you with the counter shaft? Then slide the counter shaft in place, replacing the dumby shaft.? I did that with my T90, kept everything down and out of the way for the rest of the installation. Just curious.
     
    Ol Fogie likes this.
  18. May 10, 2021
    Mr Vaughan

    Mr Vaughan

    we did everything in the wrong order when we were putting our T90 together, not near as well as you did your more complex one. :bow:
     
  19. May 11, 2021
    Fireball

    Fireball Well-Known Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Pullman, WA
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    The new transmission mount showed up today. Novak machines the adapter for Borg Warner 31-2268 equivalent mounts. I'm not super fond of polyurethane mounts and I don't trust the quality of new rubber mounts, so I ordered an actual NOS Borg Warner mount from ebay. Guaranteed to last longer than anything you can get at the FLAPS:
    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    Then I buttoned up the transmission. I started by cleaning all the bolt holes with a tap and brake cleaner.

    Trimmed the rear gasket for the new bolt location and where I ground clearance for the transfer case bolt:
    [​IMG]

    The supplied front gasket is too big because the retainer has been machined smaller for the GM bellhousing. It needs to be trimmed for the bellousing to sit flat:
    [​IMG]

    New OD traced with a pen so I can cut it out with scissors:
    [​IMG]

    Much better!:
    [​IMG]

    PTO cover bolted in place. I used spray-on gasket sealer on both sides of the gasket and ARP sealer on the bolts since 5 of 6 are open into the case:
    [​IMG]

    Seal installed in the front retainer with form-a-gasket on the outside and grease on the inside. It feels like you're putting it in backwards from most seals, but that's the way it needs to go. Spring side to the oil:
    [​IMG]

    Front retainer installed and torqued. Novak supplied lock washers for the screws but they are too big and overhang the retainer OD. The bellhousing won't fit over them. I used blue Loctite instead:
    [​IMG]

    The shifter felt good originally so I'm not opening up a can of worms by disassembling it. All I did was install the new plastic rubbing blocks with some assembly lube:
    [​IMG]

    Shifter housing and shifter temporarily attached for testing. It seems to shift great:
    [​IMG]

    And finally the shift housing installed with gasket, gasket sealer, bolt sealer, and properly torqued bolts. Ready for degreasing, masking, and paint tomorrow:
    [​IMG]
     
  20. May 11, 2021
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
    Joined:
    Mar 4, 2003
    Messages:
    5,466
    Nice job, but Psst - just bolt the front bearing retainer on with the gasket and trim with razor blade... You will need to do it again some day. I turned both of my T18 setups down too.
     
    Fireball likes this.
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