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Ross Bellcrank Ball Replacement

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by Thean, Apr 4, 2018.

  1. Apr 4, 2018
    Thean

    Thean Member

    HSB Idaho
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    Sep 1, 2017
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    88
    Anyone know where to purchase a replacement ball for the Ross Bellcrank?
    This is the flat plate style bell crank with a TRE hole in one side and a welded on ball stud on the other end.
    Also, is it proper for the radius of the cup inserts to not match the radius of the ball? Looks like whoever owned this, kept cranking it down and its made one face of the ball match the face of the mating insert.
    TIA


    Edit:
    Overall height 2" (close approx.)
    Height from top of ball to flange at base 1.325" (note: flat spot machined in top)
    Ball dia. .865"
    Weld stud diameter ???
     
    Last edited: Apr 6, 2018
  2. Apr 4, 2018
    TIm E

    TIm E Aggressively average

    NW Arkansas
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    I wonder if one of these would be close in size...

    Ball Stud Clutch Control MB, GPW, CJ's, FC 150

    If you can't find one, I am pretty sure you could send it to Mcruff and he'd be able to make/install a new ball end for you. He does excellent work.
     
    Thean likes this.
  3. Apr 4, 2018
    Thean

    Thean Member

    HSB Idaho
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    I believe they are smaller diameter. Ill have to check on that.
    I presume Mcruff is a machinist on the forum?
     
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  4. Apr 4, 2018
    Tom_Hartz

    Tom_Hartz Member 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    North Carolina
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    Yes he is.
     
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  5. Apr 4, 2018
    Thean

    Thean Member

    HSB Idaho
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    When I was at Advance Adapters, the engineers dug this old wood box out, looked like it had been locked away for 50 years, covered in that sticky dust only equipment from a machine shop builds up. Ended up being a ball cutting tool for cutting radius on the lathe. It was a pretty cool tool. Haven't seen one like it since.

    This looks like a decent way to go for one offs:
     
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  6. Apr 4, 2018
    Steve's 70-5

    Steve's 70-5 Active Member

    Louisville, Ky
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    Nov 12, 2009
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    Was at the Willys Jeep Reunion. There was a guy that redid bellcrancks for flat fenders. I will see if I still have his card at home. Maybe look at the 2a site if Mcruff does not pan out.
     
    Thean likes this.
  7. Apr 7, 2018
    Thean

    Thean Member

    HSB Idaho
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    Updated pivot ball dimensions.
    Thoughts on using some old Carhart material as the dust seal/boot? Looks similar to what is currently on there. 2x layers of heavy cotton wove cloth. The grease seems to act as a binder between the layers.
     
  8. May 26, 2019
    Thean

    Thean Member

    HSB Idaho
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    Just getting back to moving forward with this bellcrank repair...
    Turns out, this CJ has the “upgraded” bellcrank, as seen here:
    Bellcrank woes
    It too has the same ball stud wear. The general OD appears to be .870” and in the worn area of ball face, .803” . Interesting enough, the draglink ball stud race inserts don’t show any wear. The stock pitman arm ball on the Ross box measures out (depending on location and dried grease) .845” - .855” ... this leads me to believe the Harry Buschert / Brian Chuchua bellcrank may have an improper diameter ball and causing the excessive wear. Both ball seat inserts in the draglink seem to have matching radius, however, I can only measure the depth of the cup utilizing calipers and straight edge, not actual dia./radius.
    So with that, I’m needing a couple measurements from stock components. Looking for ball stud diameter measurements on the stock bellcrank and from the pitman arm on the Ross box.
    Your help is appreciated!

    Thean
     
  9. May 26, 2019
    Keys5a

    Keys5a Sponsor

    Florida Keys
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    It sounds like you figured out that your bellcrank is an aftermarket replacement piece, not OEM Willys/Jeep. A machinist is your best bet, just make sure its made of decent steel, maybe 4140?
    -Donny
     
  10. May 26, 2019
    Thean

    Thean Member

    HSB Idaho
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    Donny, correct! Hoping a few people can get me dimensions from their OEM ball stud so I can either turn a new one myself or have someone else turn one for me. As far as proper/best/oem material for such a part, I haven’t even headed down that road. I’ll keep your suggestion in mind though. That sounds about what most aftermarket “upgrade” ball joints and TREs are made of.
     
  11. May 26, 2019
    Chilly

    Chilly Active Member

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    Would be nice to heat treat it. What is the wear part? Cup or ball? I assume the cup is the cheaper half. 4140 is great steel, will harden well enough too, if you choose. But being a steering part that can ruin the last 5 min of your life if it cracks, use a reputable heat treater. Poor heat treat is worse than no heat treat. Seriously, dont mess around with this part.
     
    Thean likes this.
  12. May 26, 2019
    Thean

    Thean Member

    HSB Idaho
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    Chilly, the replaceable seat inserts on the draglink, I would believe, SHOULD be the wear item as they are easily serviceable. However, I don’t know the original design intent. I might see if I can find someone with the proper equipment for a hardness test. Possibly someone knows definitively whether or not these pieces were heat treated in OEM or even this aftermarket part?
    I do agree with your sentiment, this is the equivalent of the “Jesus nut” on a helicopter. :D
     
  13. May 26, 2019
    melvinm

    melvinm Member

    Arvada Co. 80003
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    These are still made By 1st Gear Offroad , Phone # 951-654-4532.
     
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  14. May 26, 2019
    Thean

    Thean Member

    HSB Idaho
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    Fancy that, Thanks Melvin! Makes my life easier.

    looks like the ball studs were flame hardened for wear ability. At least that’s what I’m finding for other applications. Have yet to find any reference to material, RC hardness, depth, etc.
     
  15. May 26, 2019
    garage gnome

    garage gnome ECJ5 welder

    Western MA
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    There is a bearing upgrade you can do to these bell cranks and make them last much longer.
     
  16. May 26, 2019
    Thean

    Thean Member

    HSB Idaho
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    Check out the bellcrank woes thread, it has pics of the old school taper roller upgrade. Which is what this one has.

    I’m going to find another draglink that I can hack on. Think I have a solution that doesn’t require turning a new ball or heat treat and will move the failure point to another factory part
     
  17. Jun 28, 2019
    Jw60

    Jw60 Sitting up n buckled down. 2024 Sponsor 2023 Sponsor 2022 Sponsor

    Sedalia MO.
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    :bump:
    What happened next?
     
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