Dana 23/27 Spider Gear Advice

Folks,

Great site with an amazing amount of knowledge!
I have a '55 CJ with a full floating axle that I think is a DANA 27, but is marked with a 23. In trying to diagnose what I assumed was a clutch or engine issue (jerking at low speed/rpm), I found damage to the rear axle. I am missing three teeth on the two side gears (see image), there is some damage to the small pinion gears, and the cross shaft wallowed out one of the holes (see image) that it slides into. The ring, pinion and cross shaft are in good shape and I've already ordered new spider gears/cross shaft and pin. My question is: what to do about the wallowed out hole. I will buy a used carrier if I have to, but I wonder if I could get by with trying to restore that hole with weld or epoxy or welding/epoxying in my new cross shaft. It seems like this is a compression-only load where a backyard repair might work. I think the spider gears failed because of the shock load created by this pin creating the slop (~0.03") so I need to address it. I'm just trying not to spend unnecessarily. Advice is welcome.

 

IIRC the Dana 23 full-floater is from an MB or GPW, WWII era Jeep. Not very strong - often replaced with a later Dana 41 or 44. Original equipment for a 55 CJ-5 would be a Dana 44 with tapered (nutted) axles, not full-floating.

If I'm right , I'd think you'd want to find a Dana 44 from a later Jeep and use that. Also IIRC, the MB/GPW had 4.88 axles. What's the ratio, front and rear? You might be able to find a replacement 44 with 4.88 gears, since this ratio was optional in the later V6-equipped Jeeps.

I'm sure you won't be able to repair the case with epoxy. Maybe try Border Parts if you need a new case for a 23. Dunno if it's the same as a 25 or 27 - maybe.

First post! Welcome from Boston.

 

X2, on Tims comments. Changing to a flanged D-44 would for sure be your best fix, given how weak the flanged axles in the model 23 are. If you do decide to repair your D-23 a new carrier is in order. do not try to fix the wallowed out cross shaft hole. No dependable way to fix it except to replace it. Those gear carriers are plentiful and cheep for the D-23.

 

You need to check out the gear count on the front axle and long term find a matching rear.
Whatever you do with a 10 spline rear axle is temporary.

 

Semi-full-floating flanged 44s for this application are desirable and scarce, only used in '70-71 CJs. If you are running the original 4-cylinder, a much more common tapered 44 from a pre-70 CJ-5 would be ok, I'd think. Not understanding about 10 spline axles... is the 23 10 spline? If you replace the axle, the gear ratios front and rear will have to match.

 

Thanks for all the replies and you all know your stuff. So, the gear ratio is 5.38. I have not hooked up the front driveshaft and have been assuming no mismatch in gear ratio. It came to me missing lots of things, but with a 1964 225 Buick V6, a T-90, Dana-18 and Warn OD. I rebuilt the rochester BC carb, leak down tests are within 5 PSI, and it has more power than I expected (maybe its my fault that it broke) I don't plan on running any tire larger than 31" and I will do my best with my right foot. My 4.0HO injected, YJ-lifted '72 commando taught me to go easy on the mods and tire sizes! These are 10-spline axles for sure. The used carriers I've seen are $225-$300. Follow on question: Do I need to do a ring and pinion setup if I get a new carrier? The ring and pinion are in fantastic shape. How about the bearings which are pressed on the carrier?

 

If it is a factory style full float rear axle and not a conversion it would be a 23-2 from an MB or GPW as others have said. Many differential parts like the pinion and side gears and I believe the ring and pinion and CASE will interchange from a 25 front differential. Double check the ring and pinion and case though. I know the side and pinion gears will interchange. If the case is oblonged out it is junk and must be replaced.

 

Awesome. Thanks for the info on interchange. The consensus seems to be that the case is junk, which is a bummer, but it is what it is.

 

I will agree they should. The military MB, GPW built during WW2 had these axles so to make the differential front and rear interchangeable. Any good military parts supply that has parts for these jeeps will likely have a carrier in stock. Also Quarter Ton Military in Ringgold Ga. probably has dozens of these carriers used in stock cheaper than new. That is where I would look first.
Again, Make no attempt to repair your cross shaft bore. simply replacing it will save you trouble, and possibly ruining your R&P if the repair fails.

 

Glad the previous was able to help.

I would check your axle ratios front and rear first. The tooth counts are stamped into the edge of the ring gear. If the ratios are actually 5.38, and you are really spending $300 for a 23-2 case, I would for sure spend some time looking for a tapered replacement axle from another CJ-5. Jeepers have been putting the 41 (from flat fenders before the CJ-5) and 44 in de-mil MBs and GPWs since the 40s, upgrading the 23-2. Pretty sure the 23-2 only has value as a restoration replacement for the WWII Jeeps.

5.38 was the most common ratio for the 4-cylinder equipped CJ-5s. The replacement axle would bolt in, and it's much stronger than the 23-2, I presume. Plus it's not really a cigar butt, but it's a common target for replacement by one of the scarce flanged 44s from a '70-71. The tapered axles should be out there and not particularly in demand.

 

I would agree with the caveat being if replacing with a D44 with tapered axles, be sure to get one of the 19 spline versions. Same hubs as the 10 spline but those shafts are a lot stronger. IIRC, those are 62 and newer.

 

I gave @Boston Bob my old d25 front carrier/case with 5.38 gear earlier this year for him to re-home. Might send him a message.
I re-geared to 4.27

The flanged 44 is 30 spline with thicker tubes and has more traction device options including selectable and torsen. The later tapered 44 is 19 spline early is 10 spline
The 19 spline is ok for daily driving but offroading with the v6 can break the shafts. You can get a powr-loc or "lunchbox" for the 19 spline and be ok for 80% of people.

The 10 spline might fit a traction aid but it simply isn't strong enough for a v6, lockers, and low gears or offroad.

My 1960 had 19 spline i think the change was closer to 57 the powrloc became an option with the 19spline rear.

a common mod is to take a 10 or 19 spline d44 housing and put a 19 or 30 spline carrier / case inside with aftermarket shafts to full floating spindles and hubs using 27 spline dana 30 lockout hubs

 

I think James is near you (the OP).
http://www.low-buck-garage.com/

He may have a line on parts that will help you.

 

Is there a 23 with this gear ratio?
I thought all the MB's an GPW's had 4.88 gears.

 

Originally yes.

 

Still not sure I don't have a DANA 27. FWIW, the ring gear is stamped with 43.8.

 

The only 27 rears I know of were in early Scouts. Wider than a CJ.

 

Doesn't the D27 use 10 ring gear bolts?

 

Why do you think it's a 27? From the Kaiser-Willys site, the 23, 25 and 27 all use the same spiders and shaft. Nothing else indicates a 27 AFAIK. This does not admit the possibility of a 27 when the axle is full-floating and marked 23. None of the CJ rear axles were full-float from the factory.

As mentioned, some Scouts had a 27 rear. Some Jeepsters came with 30s, but all the CJs are Dana 41 or 44, or AMC Corporate 20.