frame and steering repair on zed's 69 cj5

well i met with the welder. great guy reacted about the same a you all, but more low key

we decided to simply cut the horns off right in front of the crossmember since that is where the damage is up to. looks like the hangers were either broken or taken off and rewelded too so he told me to get the front 15 inches approx from another cj frame and he could weld and box it making as strong or stonger than the original. about 4 hrs of shop time. $180 to $200.

i found an 83 cj5 renegade which was in a fire. so i am having them cut the frame from the motor mounts forward and am taking both left and right sides. rusty but already boxed in at factory and even tho the 83 cj were longer than the 69 it should fit or be adapted, right? later i can put the passenger side frame end on when i can afford the shop time.

getting those for $25 total.

comments. or warnings before i do this?
picts for reference on my cj are listed in the thread" i'm calmer now.. steering questions"

next, i found the steering train from a 98 jeep and also a steering train from a 98 grand cherokee.

the grand cherrokee's saginaw is clean and i can use the pump i have.

the saginaw is $75 with the pitman, the tierod and connecting rod with the steering rod is $35. i figure i will need to have the shop cut them to a new length and rethread the end? or would you recommend i get the steering from the small body jeep instead?

i'll track down a column that doesn't look as weird as the airbag columns some where else. i know of a or 70's era grand wagoneer with a column but had auto.

what do you all think?

am i on the right track?

or is there a way to get rid of the bellcrank and two piece tierods and still have manual steering getting rid of all that looseness in the older steering.

 

im not sure about the steering stuff, but it sounds like you atleast have a great plan going, good luck with it, and hope all goes smoothly

 

Seems that there are lots of frames around - more frames than bodies. If you ask, I expect you'll easily find frame horns from a Pre-72 Jeep (CJ or Commando) that will match your frame exactly.

The later (82 and later?) Saginaw power boxes use an o-ring seal instead of a flare nut. You'll need to take the fitting from the back of a newer PS pump to use hoses that match the o-ring style on a newer PS box. Apparently it just screws out of the back of a GM PS pump.

I don't think you need to pay a premium for a real Jeep PS box. The FSJers like the box from a recent S-10 Blazer 4x4; typically cheap and available. Only has 3 mounting tabs, but that hasn't been a problem. I think you'd want to get the newest one you can so that you don't have to reseal or adjust it. A newer box will give you more road feel too - my truck (for example) is way overboosted, as were all the Jeeps of that era (IMO).

 

Aren't the later CJ's frames wider? I know they get wider in the rear but what about the front?

As for the box I would not be surprised at all if the bolts and fittings on the TJ box were metric. I'm probably wrong though.

The fitting in the pump does unscrew but watch out for the check ball coming out when you do unscrew it as it has a spring behind it. I would think that a good hydraulic shop would be able to make you hoses with o-ring seals on one end and a flare on the other. This way you would not have to mess with the pump.

The tie rods can be cut down and re-tapped to fit the Jeep. Just make sure you cut the end with right hand threads off because left hand taps are expensive. The draglink (rod between the pitman arm and steering knuckle) may also need to be cut down and tapped. This may have to be done on a lathe though as I recall the threaded area is noticeably smaller than the rest of the link.

For the steering shaft, I recommend components from Flaming River or Borgeson. You will not have to replace these for a very long time. Hope this helps

 

Wouldn't the spring hangers be different (wider) on the newer frame too?

 

yes on both counts the hangers and the boxed. but if the welder can fit them they are stronger than the pre amc's. he wants me to cut off the hangers on the new frame parts and use the old ones so he can align the new driver's side perfectly.

any running comments are welcome and begged for before i commit to it. as i said this is a new area for me. and the idea is to get frame back to strength or better before the po screwed it up putting the odd saginaw in it.

i appreciate your patience, experience, and help. thanks

 

what is a "reasonable" price for this stuff?

 

I bought a saginaw power steering box off of a large GM car for $30, I can get those all that I want for that price. Now manual boxes are a different story, they are harder to come by but not more expensive at least not that I have found otherwise yet, I am looking for Vanguard one right now to go with all his other saginaw stuff.

 

I've used the steering box off of a large and mid size GM cars a couple of times and I actually like them better than useing the jeep steering box when I use them on the Hyway any at all, They are slower and that makes the jeep less"darty" on the hyway.
Also used steering column from mid 70's camaro and firebird they require a few changes but work well and are easy to wire up.

 

thanks everyone for the advise and support on all this for so long. as the site designated paranoid it is my duty to continue to ask these questions until i actually commit to the repair.

since i am taking the ends frame horns separately from each other on the 83 ren. the width of the 83 cj and my 69 shouldn't matter, right? i guess i should meausre the od and id of the new boxed horns but i think they're close, am i correct. are there any warnings?

i am thinking about finding the column from a 85 cherokee. no air bag, has tilt, what d'yall think so far?

i will probably also "downsize" the tires for torque and road handling when i can afford to?

 

tmgr,

i found a 2002 s10 blazer saginaw power box with 23,000 mi on it. very clean car had no front end damage. i have numbers off it but how do i tell the ratio? i would rather have more turns from lock to lock so it doesn't dart around on the highway when i get to 50 to 60 mph. or if i have to avoid some other car in town.

else i may go to a larger car gm unit as jd7 wrote about?

 

the 83 is wider in the rear but the front is the same I'm pretty sure. and yes, thanks your comments have been a help

 

Should be able to "recycle" your steering box. you need to have one tie rod across, and one tie rod down to the knuckle from the box.

 

The S10 box may not be the best for your application. I don't know the ratio - I'd guess it's about 3 turns lock-to-lock and variable ratio. You can't use the pitman arm because the tapered hole is too small. On a Jeep truck, the mounting is so solid that 3 vs 4 mounting tabs doesn't matter. Hanging out on the end of a CJ frame, you may need the 4th tab.

 

tim and warloch, thanks that helps a lot.

what year camero was that box from warloch? any particular model?

 

cool thanks.

another piece of the puzzle may have been solved.