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buick engine and transfer case

Discussion in 'Early CJ5 and CJ6 Tech' started by RedWing, Oct 30, 2005.

  1. Nov 7, 2005
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    From the looks of the picture you have a dana 20 and I would also say that it is not original as the shims to lower the crossmember are missing.
    I don't think that any 71 models would have come with a dana 20 as the rear drivesahft would have been different. True there were alot of different things on the 71 model that were not on the 69 and earlier models. The front parking lights should have large clear lenses with amber bulbs, rear mounted fuel tank, could have Stewart Warner amp and oil gauges in the dash, could have a factory riveted on ash tray on the dash, rear axle would indeed be flanged instead of 2 piece, grill housing will be different than most earlier models, the taillights will be metal casing about 3" in diameter and step out to a 4" diameter brake light reflector. Should have a small AMC logo on the rear drivers side of the tailgate. Mine had a factory installed trailer light pigtail in the C channel above the draw bar. Brakes will be 10" drums all around. The 71 production would have stopped around august to the 1st of september. mine was built in april of 71. Most all of the changes to the 71 model were also on the late 1970 model also.
     
  2. Nov 7, 2005
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    The dif is centered. I didnt bring those pictures to work with me today.
    The number is 8305017 374123 if that helps.

    The fuel tank is under the cargo area. I don't remember, but i think the sticker on the dash (drivers side) said Aril, 1971.
     
  3. Nov 7, 2005
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    Your jeep was built shortly before mine (142 units earlier), so it would have been built in march or april of 1971, that means the transfercase and rear axle have indeed been changed.
    My serial number is 374265, built in April '71
     
  4. Nov 7, 2005
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    Its not yet my Jeep. I'm hoping to purchase it today, but I was concerned that it didnt match what i have learned from this site.

    Do you think it would still be worth buying? The body and frame are very solid, it runs good (225 v6).

    Would this have been a desirable modification?
     
  5. Nov 7, 2005
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    I don't think the mod is a bad thing at all, parts (axleshafts) are more available for this rear axle than the offset one that was factory and may be why it was swapped. The dana 20 while the same basic transfercase is much quieter due to the changes that are made to it to run centered and will in most cases last longer because of it. If they used the intermediate axle it is still a flanged dana 44 and would have the larger 11" brakes (or at least it should) at worst case someone used an AMC 20 axle. The AMC 20 axle has a round cover, where as the dana 44 uses one that is shaped more like a stop sign.
    I wouldn't think these mods if well done would hurt its selling ability or you buying it, most guys wouldn't know!;)
     
  6. Nov 7, 2005
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    Thanks for the input. Thats how I felt about it. It looks like the 44 axle and it looks like a decent installation. I could tell it wasnt original.

    Now the steering conversion, that's a whole other mess. If this vehicle becomes mine today I'll get into that as well

    This is a great site and I so greatly have appreciated all of the help and advice.
     
  7. Nov 7, 2005
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    You should change your user data to reflect at least what town and state you live in, it might help, as a member may be a few miles away.
     
  8. Nov 7, 2005
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    Thanks I will. My mind is still swimming trying to get used to all of this.
     
  9. Nov 8, 2005
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    Well I purchased the Jeep today. The body and frame are in great shape.

    I have a question regarding the changed model 20 transfer case and the changed rear axle which appears to be the model 44.

    The drive shaft leaves the center of the axle and heads in a direction slightly toward the drivers side where it attaches to the output shaft of the 20.

    Is this situation ok? Should'nt the output shaft of the differential line up straight with the output shaft of the model 20?

    What have I gotten myself into?
     
  10. Nov 8, 2005
    captain cj

    captain cj Member

    Crystal Beach...
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    Just my 2 cents but wasnt the stock trans for the 225 the T-86 not the T-14 unless it changed in the last year:?
     
  11. Nov 8, 2005
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    The t14 became the standard 3 speed behind the v6 in 1969 and the t86 was discontinued.
     
  12. Nov 8, 2005
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    I'm new to all of this, so I really don't know. I was told that some previous owner switched the 18 transfer case to the 20 and a center differential model 44 axle.

    I don't know if they changed the transmission when they did that and I cant find any stamps on it that would indicate what it is.

    I'm also concerned that new set up doesnt align properly with the axle.

    Any thought or could you point me in any direction?
     
  13. Nov 8, 2005
    Patrick

    Patrick Super Moderator Staff Member

    Los Alamos, NM
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    AFAIK, the T14 was inroduced in late '67... The t-14 I put in my '5 came out of an early '68 CJ6............
     
  14. Nov 8, 2005
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    How do you identify the different models. My jeep has had modifications and I'm trying to get an idea of what i have.

    Any comments on the alignment issue?

    Any idea where I could get some exhaust manifolds and Y pipe?
     
  15. Nov 9, 2005
    Mcruff

    Mcruff Earlycj5 Machinist

    Albertville, AL
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    For one the t14 is syncronized between 1st and 2nd and also between 2nd and 3rd gear where the t90 and t86 are only syncro'd between 2nd and 3rd gears. The t14 if I remember correctly and its been awhile say t14A or 13XX on the top of the cover, the t86 will most likely have t90 cast on the top edge of the shift tower as will the t90. The t14 has the drain hole on the passenger side and the t86 and t90 have it on the drivers side of the transmission.
    Oh and the t86 and t90 are like 8.0" long and the t14 is a little longer than this, something like 8.5" long
     
  16. Nov 9, 2005
    timgr

    timgr We stand on the shoulders of giants. 2022 Sponsor

    Medford Mass USA
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    Re the driveshaft angle, the total angle is what matters. It's ok if the differential is offset, as long as that does not make a larger angle than you would tolerate if the TC output and diff pumpkin were aligned.

    If you want to put the Jeep back to stock, the Dana 18 will be widely available and inexpensive. The original offset flanged Dana 44 axle however, is a scarce and desirable thing.

    Have you used 4WD yet? Check that the gear ratio in the front and rear axles is the same.
     
  17. Nov 9, 2005
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    I did use the 4wheel drive breifly last night and it appeared fine. It went in and out of gear real easy and drove fine. I could tell if it was actually powering the Front wheels. It was late when I got it home.

    I ok with the modification that some previous owner has done, as it sounds like they may be desirable. The drive shaft ange seems a little steep to me, but I don't think the offset is making it any steeper. I didnt measure the offset but just by eyeballing it, id say maybe a couple of inches toward the drivers side.
     
  18. Nov 9, 2005
    Warloch

    Warloch Did you say Flattie??? Staff Member

    Falcon, CO
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    Go to Tom Wood's site - he has a real good writeup on drive shaft angles and how to measure them. Then contact a good local driveline shop and talk to them. They will be able to tell you the pros and cons for the angles you have.

    As for the tcase / axle swap. The only negative would be that it precludes you from using a Warn/Saturn OD.
     
  19. Nov 9, 2005
    timgr

    timgr We stand on the shoulders of giants. 2022 Sponsor

    Medford Mass USA
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    And the Dana 20 has a 2:1 low range, v. the better 2.42:1 of the Dana 18. Many like the D18 offset because it helps in straddling obstacles on the trail, and it makes your rear driveshaft angle somewhat less.
     
  20. Nov 9, 2005
    RedWing

    RedWing Member

    Sutton Bay
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    Thanks for all the input. My goal when is to get as close to original as practical. I don't anticipate severe off road use. I would like to have a safe reliable vehicle that can drive at high speeds, handle Michigan snow and an occasional stroll through the woods.

    This site has been invaluable. I've already learned a lot. I'm sure as we get through the resoration I be asking several more questions.
     
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